Liana Satenstein - Superstars Only

Daniela

Okay, hopefully this picks up.

Liana

So, basically, I went into the office one day and I was looking pretty horrible. I went on TikTok. I was seeing people do these things, and I did it kind of sarcastically. People couldn't tell if it was satire or real.

Daniela

I remember the comments were a little confused.

Liana

It was just funny because I did that and I started doing a few more, but then it felt kind of vacuous. We're in the most international spot in New York.

Daniela

Yeah, Union Square.

Liana

I mean Nordstrom Rack. Everyone is coming for discounts. I used to live in Queens way out next to the airport, and I would go to Rego Park Century 21. You feel like you're in Eastern Europe.

Daniela

It was my boyfriend's idea to do it at Nordstrom Rack and I totally jumped on it because it's really universal. It's not a thrift store, but you definitely have to search.

Liana

Yeah. you can find some great stuff, though. But yeah, I like this. Never pay full price. Okay, so what did I do—you're gonna have a real field day transcribing this, my friend. Okay, so I was doing TikTok, though. I'm sort of mortified that people know me through that, but I guess that's good. But it's not who I am, really. The outfit stuff gets very exhausting, because I only own so many clothes. I'm not going to go into the office every single day with a new outfit.

Daniela

Well, I think that's kind of the vibe I got from you. There's a very specific TikTok energy, especially with outfit videos and I didn't get that from you and I think that's why I was intrigued. I didn't believe you when you said you worked at Vogue. I couldn't believe that someone would be that accessible or open. Does that make sense?

Liana

I get it. We watch the Devil Wears Prada. I can understand how that could be the thought process.

Daniela

But from the outside I thought you were cool and effortless. Then I was like, I like her style. I don't really follow anyone on Tik Tok. I just let the for-you page work its magic and show it to me again. If it knows me, It'll give it back.

Liana

Oh, it's like a boomerang.

Daniela

Yeah, I'm just like, "Okay, algorithm. Go ahead, do your thing." And then you popped up again, maybe like a year later.

Liana

Oh, wow. What was I doing this time?

Daniela

I think you were interviewing another fashion writer.

Liana

I probably was harassing my former editor.

Daniela

And then from there I just found your Instagram. And then I read your blog, NEVERWORNS. And then I watched your interviews and I liked it. That's why I asked to interview you. The idea for the Nordstrom Rack is that I just quit my job and am looking for a new outfit for my next interview. I used to work in an art gallery.

Liana

Oh, wow. Gallery girl. What did you do there?

Daniela

I was at the front desk.

Liana

That's a killer job. Like, that makes me feel like it's the 1990s, you're in Chelsea and you're answering calls. I don't know if that's even how it is anymore. But it sounds glam.

Daniela

It was. When I first got the job, I was head over heels.

Liana

Listen for the first few months, you are like, "This is incredible. This is great." And then you're like, oh, fuck, it's like actually a job.

Daniela

Yeah. I used to work across from Paint 'N Pour, which is the place where people go to paint sunsets and palm trees while they drink wine. And I was like, what if I was a paint instructor? And I was thinking today at Nordstrom Rack, we can find an interview outfit. Where do you usually start when picking out an outfit?

Liana

Pants, probably. Then you can build it up. What do you like? I like a good slack moment where you can transition it to just going out and doing nothing. You should try a low slung, pinstripe pants. Oh, wait, these aren't horrible. There's an embedded pleat.

Daniela

Did you always want to be a fashion writer? Where do you go to school? How did you start?

Liana

I grew up in a small town in Massachusetts. Very pilgrim vibes. Nothing to do. I was always very bored, so I really wanted to get out of there. I think magazines were an incredible outlet for me at the time. I started going on the internet more and fashion was like a huge outlet for me. Just the idea of fashion and New York. I knew I always wanted to get into it somehow. I think like every girl during my era watched Devil Wears Prada and thought they could be that girl. I think hordes of women actually moved here inspired by that movie that was supposed to make you not want to work in this world. I still think it has that power, weirdly. I ended up actually leaving school my senior year and I studied in Ukraine for a year when it was Crimea. My grandmother was from Kiev back in the day and she escaped from there after some heinous shit went down. I was always interested in my roots. For background, I'm Jewish American. I was the only Jewish person in my town, so I always felt a little bit different and wanted to rediscover who I am and where I came from. Anyways, this program came to my school and they were like, "You can study anywhere in the world and we will pay for your plane ticket." I was like, I'm getting the fuck out of here. I left my high school boyfriend and I studied in Ukraine for a year. I was working in the community a lot when I came back. Then I studied in St. Petersburg for a year and then I moved to New York finally. I got an apartment with two Russian women next to the airport in Queens, so I learned basically how to speak provincial bootleg Russian. When I was here, I was trying to get a job and I couldn't get a job. I interned at Women's Wear Daily and I had interned at Marie Claire. I was not a great intern. One of them was working in the fashion closet and checking in and out samples. I was like, what the fuck am I doing? Marie Claire was fine, I just don't think I fit in very well. I felt like smelly-girl-at-the-lunch-table vibes. I was doing odd jobs in the city. I did sales for some guy in Chelsea, then I found this job off of Craigslist and got fired from that. I was a hostess actually in Tribeca at some Austrian sausage, brunch, place. I was doing all these things while I was fucking hating my life because I was sitting in this Tribeca restaurant watching these bitches come in and get their reservation. Anyways, long story short, I ended up paying my own way to go to Ukraine and photograph Fashion Week there. I told Women's Wear Daily I was going and, because I was still tight with the accessories editor there, I got like my first clip. I pitched to Fashionista at the time. I went to Crown Heights and I photographed these Orthodox Jewish women who dress really well. There's some really interesting ways of how they approach dress because, when you're Orthodox you can't show your body, so they have to figure out different ways to tweak and dress but still be chic. Then Vogue reached out one day on LinkedIn. And then I met with the then creative director and my then boss. And that was it. And I was so broke. I spent all my money on printing my resume and it was so expensive because I was doing it at Staples.

Daniela

Were you doing fancy paper? Did you have a folder and everything for it?

Liana

Yeah. I think I still have a copy of this whole thing that I did because I was printing out clips and PDFs, too. I'd written for Vogue Ukraine at this point, which was cool. But, yeah, I was there for almost nine years. Until January 6: forever the day known as when I left Vogue and also the insurrection. I still write for them. And I still love my boss and I love every single person and I think that's why I was there for a long time, too.

Daniela

First of all, I can't even believe that Vogue reached out through LinkedIn.

Liana

Girl, me too. The woman at the time—she was active. I made sure to put all my clips on there and everything I was doing. I was like throwing everything out into the universe to make it happen.

Daniela

You put in the work. Manifestation.

Liana

Yeah. Also doing. Is that a part of manifestation?

Daniela

Oh yeah, you gotta do it. You can't just wish upon a star and then get it, you know?

Liana

I don't know. Manifestation is a weird word that people use now.

Daniela

Yeah, I started to hear it more during COVID when people were desperate for hope. They couldn't control what was going on around them, so they had to manifest their way out of COVID or quarantine.

Liana

That's a good way to put it.

Daniela

So you left recently to start NEVERWORNS full time?

Liana

Yeah. I'm working on a few projects too, which are on the DL. NEVERWORNS is public, obviously. I love doing it. I love talking to people about their clothes, but not really about their clothes. For example, I don't give a shit if you're wearing COMME Des GARÇONS, blah blah blah whatever. I want to know how you got to wearing that and I think clothes are the most epic vehicle for opening someone up. Oh, it's my friend, Nima. "Nima! What's up?"

Daniela

I never knew Nordstrom Rack was the spot.

Liana

Now you know. I also don't know what you should wear for the top portion. I kind of feel you should do sporty. Okay, where were we?

Daniela

You were talking about NEVERWORNS and that clothes are good to get to know someone.

Liana

Right. It's a good way to get to know someone and to have them open up because everyone has clothes and they all tell some sort of story. If you sat down with me and you just started with my clothes—

Daniela

We can do it right now. Okay, so should we start with your earrings?

Liana

So my mom is an antique dealer and she finds all these things at thrift shops and stuff and she found these in a jar somewhere. She found these gold hoops and these diamonds for nothing. [Points at her top] I bought this with her. I had her come up to New York like seven years ago. We went to some thrift shop in the East Village owned by some Russian woman. I think her name is Angelica. She yells a lot. These pants which I got on The RealReal. They're old Dolce. I got them for nothing. It's a full suit, I'm just not wearing the suit jacket. I wear them because I like them low-slung. I was going through a suit phase because I was going through this y2k "I'm crazy and I'm into Blumarine" phase. I needed a tabula rasa sort of vibe. And then the shoes are actually my mom's, which I'm pretty sure she got at Filene's Basement. I don't know if you have that in Miami, but it was like Nordstrom Rack but more designer.

Daniela

Shoutout to your mom.

Liana

Shoutout to my mom. Oh, and the bag: Tory Burch. Tory's been crushing it. I'm a vintage girl. I pretty much exclusively wear vintage, 95% of the time except for my underwear. But the bag—she really knocked it out of the park. They sent me this because I've been doing work for them. Oh, and then the visor because I'm elderly and you should use some protection.

Daniela

Where's it from?

Liana

Amazon. This is like one of the 5% of new things that I buy. I don't know if I actually even said what I needed to say.

Daniela

I mean, I just learned that your mom was a big influence and that she's an antique dealer.

Liana

Yeah, and that's actually something that shaped how I buy too because she would just find things at yard sales, estate sales, trailer parks, thrift shops, whatever. She's never paid full price. She would navigate quality wise.

Daniela

My mom would always have stuff in her closet and she would always give them to me and I would reject it when I was younger. But now I realized my mom—she's got it going on. And now I love raiding her closet. You just have to mature a little bit.

Liana

Yeah, once you get older you realize things. Should we go to the shoe section? We need a shoe situation. I'm getting a 90s sitch that I want to lean into for you. I like this for you, whether you like it or not.

Daniela

Thank you. I love your style, so I'm honored to be styled by you.

Liana

We'll see. You haven't tried it on yet.

Daniela

I also am a big suit girl, but I've never owned my own suit before. Do you have any suit shopping tips?

Liana

Dolce. 90s or early 2000s. I'm talking like 2002 is your limit. And then The RealReal. You can maybe find something on Poshmark. Also, Ralph Lauren has killer suits. Tory in six and a half. What's your size?

Daniela

I'm a nine.

Liana

Oh, mama.

Daniela

It's tough.

Liana

If you were an eight, you just wouldn't be able to find a shoe.

Daniela

Thrifting for shoes is the hardest. Every time I see a shoe, it's always a six or a seven. I've had the worst luck.

Liana

Let's find you something. [Squeezes past people in the shoe aisle and picks up a pair of shoes] Nordstrom Rack has their own brand?

Daniela

Wow. I like the square toe.

Liana

I'm kind of excited for this.

Daniela

This was pretty fast. You just kind of whip it together.

Liana

I like the sporty top. You could wear it after your interview and still look good.

Daniela

What were some of your favorite brands growing up?

Liana

When I first went to an H&M my mind was blown. I was like 14 or something. I actually started thrifting a lot. I was dating a really lovely skater, guitarist boy in high school and we would thrift together. Anything I could find thrifted. Like a great leather jacket. I was really into how models dressed in New York.

Daniela

How old were you when you first ever came to New York?

Liana

I went on a camp trip. I went to camp in New Haven at a very religious camp. [Picks up another pair of shoes and sits on top of the stack in her arms] Steve Madden with a wedge. We're doing it. It's titled Shapely. I think we're good. I'm actually very excited to see this look. Anyways, my mind was blown when I came to New York. It was like everything I'd ever dreamed of. But then I didn't come back until I was in college. I went to Hofstra which is in Long Island. I'd never been to Long Island. I didn't tour colleges. I just was like, Oh, they gave me money? I guess I'll go there. I failed like my first three years of high school, so I didn't really have options. And I got to do internships. I think if I didn't actually go to school here I would've been kind of screwed because you weren't able to do internships.

Daniela

I'm really new to this interviewing stuff and you seem to be a pro. What are some of your tips when it comes to interviewing people?

Liana

I mean, you should have your talking points, but then you can usually just go as a conversation. It's probably harder with famous people. Have an idea of what you're going to ask ahead of time.

Daniela

This is my first time doing one like this.

Liana

It's a great place to do it. I did a series at Vogue called shopping with Vogue and I'd go with someone to go buy something at a store. It's a good way to profile the store but also the person.

Daniela

Would you pick the store?

Liana

The person would pick the store. Or I would if they couldn't think of a place. Vogue never was like, "You're going here and you're profiling this person."

Daniela

That was another question I had—how much creative freedom did you get there?

Liana

95%, but something I want to note is that you have the fun things and then you have your job.

Daniela

You have to stay on top of everything.

Liana

Yeah, and you have meetings on top of everything. At the end of the day, it is a job. It's not like I'm just going to fashion shows and being seen.

Liana

This is a fire look. Wait, this is so good. I'm impressed with myself.

Daniela

You did good. I haven't had the time to look at myself. No, this is fun. This is great. It is very, very 90s.

Daniela

What are your thoughts on Nordstrom Rack?

Liana

Listen, I am not the spokesman on sustainability. I actually got into the concept of shopping responsibly and all that fun stuff through shopping vintage. Also, just being sad at Fashion Week because you see all these clothes come down the runway, you hear where they're sourcing them, and it's just like, none of this needs to be made. We would be fine if we just used deadstock and wore old clothes for the rest of our lives. It's killing us, truly. Why not just buy used? You can wear your own shit, no one else has it, and you're not buying new things. I just think people should use deadstock. Companies should use deadstock. Big corporations should use deadstock and make new things from it.

Daniela

I haven't shopped at a store like that in a while. And a lot of it too is because of budget.

Liana

Well, yeah, also I never had the money to buy new things. Like, I wasn't that fucking girl on the SSENSE sale. I was like, who the fuck is buying the shit and how are they buying this shit?

Liana

Let's go to Hot Tips. I just feel bad because I don't know if I gave you anything that you wanted. I also don't want to cut you off if you need more.

Daniela

I also just have fun talking. I'm also sorry if I'm—

Liana

Stop apologizing. I think I do that too. What are we apologizing for? We shouldn't be like, "I'm not X, Y, and Z." That's a piece of advice. You're doing it. I think that's a big thing. Listen, I get messages from people all the time. They'll ask, "How do I get into media? What advice would you give me?" I'm like, "What are you interested in?" They can't tell you. They're like, "I liked the Miu Miu runway." And I'm like, "Me too, but why?" Explain to me what that gives you as a feeling. What are you obsessed with? Like, I fucking love Lenny Kravitz in the music video "Again". I love the feeling that video gives me. I'm obsessed with it. So, what do I do? I basically try to learn everything I can about that video and who's in it.

Daniela

You just have to truly love what you're doing.

Liana

Yeah, and be genuine about it. Anyone can like a Prada show. But why? I just write about what I like. For example, the Balenciaga motorcycle bag, which I'm still seeing. I wrote that article back in 2018. I said I was obsessed with the Balenciaga motorcycle bag and this is why. This is the feeling, this is the vibe.

Daniela

It's like, why do I think something is cool?

Liana

When you're basically overloaded with information like that, it's easy to be swayed. For me personally, I just don't connect with Runway. I've always found it very unattainable for me specifically. My mood is more seeing a girl on the street who's dressed really well and just has something about her. That's what I want. It's not seeing something on the runway. I'm more in the vein of the everyday and taking bits and pieces from people that I like. [Gestures towards an older woman while we're waiting to cross Fifth Ave.] For example, this woman walking here. I love her linen pants and sports shoes, the little jewelry and the sporty casual bag. Am I gonna wear the whole entire thing? No, but maybe I'll take a part of that. [A man cuts through the crowd wearing a pair of neon green sunglasses above his prescription glasses] I love when men wear double glasses like that guy over there. I think it's incredible because you know that they're actually wearing it and using it. I just find some of this stuff on the runway to be cheap shots for fucking TikTok, at this point. I hate it. No one's just walking around in a miniskirt where you can see your labia hanging out. It looks horrible. What job are you going to in that? I want to see women who are working and look good moving through the world. I want to see what they're wearing and where they're going. I don't want to see some girl who's not going anywhere. But, I get it. Like, we have to do these things. But, that's being sold in stores? I just don't understand. I'm also the worst person for fashion.

Daniela

I would read your blog when I was bored at work.

Liana

Yeah? I'm like, do people read this? I'm just writing it for myself.

Daniela

But I think that's the beauty of it, too. Do you have more fun writing for yourself?

Liana

It depends. I like doing it, but is it useful for people? I don't know. Sometimes something does really well, sometimes it doesn't. I don't know if people want to read six paragraphs about a visor that I bought on Amazon, but I like doing this stuff because I think there's a lot of cool history that you can weave into it. I think people really like service-y things. Like, "Buy These Five Things".

Daniela

I think that's kind of why I gravitated towards your writing because it felt personal and I felt like I was learning something versus being sold something.

Liana

Okay, good. That's nice to hear.

Daniela

So you're a runner.

Liana

I run every morning pretty much.

Daniela

I tried running recently. I got a sharp pain in my side.

Liana

Oh, really? Did you try once?

Daniela

Yeah, recently.

Liana

Try more, though. I hated running. I actually think it saved my life. I think I'd be majorly depressed. I need to do it every morning to wake up and feel my endorphins and feel like I did something. What are you wearing today, by the way?

Daniela

Well, I got this at a thrift store by my apartment called Cauz for Pawz, where all the money goes to vets. They sell stuff for like $5. I got the skirt from savers.

Liana

I can't believe you're here.

Daniela

I won't watch.

Liana

I mean, you can. Some people like watching this stuff. I actually got approached for feet pics recently.

Daniela

Really? In person or through DM?

Liana

Through DM. I couldn't believe it. I was in shock. I was like, I'm not going to do this because it's just not for me.

Daniela

How much was he willing to pay?

Liana

Not enough. He offered to pay for my pedicure and, like, under $100. And I was like, Nuh-uh. 100 plus baby.

Daniela

Well, I'm honored to get this for free.

Daniela

Did you have a celebrity you were obsessed with?

Liana

Who am I obsessed with? Maybe it's not specific people, but I have like 10 films that I watch on repeat constantly. I like movies about women navigating the city. It's always these movies from 1996 to 2003, give or take. A Perfect Murder with Gwyneth Paltrow. Every woman needs to watch this. She's an uptown zillionaire married to another zillionaire and the wardrobe is incredible and she's having an affair. Sliding Doors. Gwyneth Paltrow, again. This is your homework. She's in England this time. Great style moment. Unfaithful. Diane Lane. Also a woman in the city. Cheats on her husband in Connecticut with a hot French guy who was in the city. Kissing Jessica Stein. Incredible film. You should watch it for style. I think a lot of fashion changed after 9/11. This was filmed pre 9/11. Fashion is incredible. It's about this artist-girl who works at a newspaper and is dating all these loser guys. She puts an ad in a newspaper because that's how people used to meet each other. She ends up meeting this girl and they end up having a relationship, but it doesn't matter. Plot—who cares? It's more about the style and how the dichotomy between the two women and the styles that they adopt from one another. Basic Instinct with Sharon Stone. I love Sharon Stone. She's like the epitome of the confident, horrible woman that I aspire to be. Girl 6. Spike Lee. Incredible New York movie. The critics hated it. Incredible style wise and the way it was shot is really great. She plays a call girl. Naomi Campbell's in it. Nine and a Half Weeks. Ken Baysinger and Mickey Rourke. This is more 80s, but still amazing. Big shoulders. She works at an art gallery. Sweetest Thing with Cameron Diaz and Christina Applegate. It's just a good girl movie. Fun 2000s one. I watch films that give me a mood. Like, I want to be that person. Like, tripping down in Tribeca into some guy's arms while I'm wearing an incredible trench coat and that square toe that we saw at Nordstrom.

Liana

My boss wrote this one. I might be in that. I don't know what I've written at this point in my life. After a while you forget. [Flips through Vogue] Ok, this is me. They gave me a lot of space here. The first line reads, "At a recent party in SoHo, I was surrounded by flirty Gen Z'ers and Cali-sober younger millennials."

Daniela

There you are. You're at a party in Soho.

Liana

It was a Highsnobiety thing. This girl was Gen Z and wearing a corset. They tried to relate it to a political thing, but people just want to look fucking hot. I don't think that's political.

Daniela

Do you have any other magazines that you like?

Liana

Vogue from the 90s. Harper's Bazaar from the 90s. I did an incredible stylist from Harper's Bazaar in the 90s for NEVERWORNS. It's gonna come out soon.

Daniela

How do you go about finding people to interview?

Liana

It's just people I'm genuinely interested in. The issue with media is that, of course, celebrities give you numbers. It's similar to the Miu Miu thing where people don't know why they liked the show. You should always do something because you like it, not because it's popular. You should be genuinely interested in it because then you will ask the right questions and make a compelling story. I want to know what people are doing and how they actually exist and live through the world, not just like how they live in a photo. Once numbers start dictating things for you, it's a slippery slope. You lose credibility because you're just in it yourself. Like, when I do sponsored content I have to be very careful about what I do. I work with The Real Real and that's because they let me do what I want. You have to be careful and you have to always say something with what you're putting out into the world.

Daniela

I feel like fashion sometimes can feel a little exclusive. But when you talk about it, I don't feel left out.

Liana

I'm not a technical person. I'm not like a runway person. I like fashion to exist in the world where I can function with it. Maybe that's why.

Daniela

What makes someone a superstar?

Superstars Only

Interview with Liana Satenstein